HANNAH WEAVER, HOST:
The Trump administration is suing New York state over one of its immigration laws. US Attorney General Pam Bondi announced they’re targeting the Green Light law, which allows undocumented immigrants to get driver’s licenses. I spoke with Lenni Benson, professor of immigration and human rights law at New York Law School, she broke down the potential impact of the suit.
BENSON: So in this current suit, what Attorney General Bondi and the Department of Justice are saying is that New York is being complicit with the furtherance of unlawful presence of people in the United States when we allow them, under our state law, to qualify for driver's licenses.
WEAVER: So this law you're talking about is the Green Light law. Is that correct?
BENSON: Yes, the driver's license law, right?
WEAVER: Yeah, so why is this something that the Trump administration is going after in particular?
BENSON: Well, the way they want to demonize our undocumented population is to say that, if you have a driver's license, you can rent a car, then you can escape law enforcement. So again, fear tactic. I mean, what the effect of a lawsuit like this and the publicity is is not so much the law will declare New York state's law to be in any violation, but instead to create greater fear. And so people won't renew their licenses, people won't apply for their licenses, and then we, the people of New York and the people of the United States, will bear the consequences of more. Who is that driver? Uninsured drivers. And so it just doesn't make any sense.
WEAVER: You beat me to the punch there with my question about the potential impacts. Are there any other impacts that you could foresee that might come about because of this lawsuit?
BENSON: You know, in New York City, one-third of our population or more, it's close to 40 percent, were born in a foreign country. If you're in the borough of Queens, every other person was born somewhere else. So who is going to be affected by this fear of being stopped by law enforcement being challenged about your papers? Frankly, it's all of us. And so, do we want to live in a society where casually walking to the subway or walking, taking the Metro North we’re said, “show me your papers, please.” I am, I'm usually more circumspect. I am a law professor. I can be neutral. No, this is Gestapo tactics. And if we give in to the — well, we have to enforce the immigration laws. Well, then how about let's enforce our tax laws? Less than 30 percent of the United States is in full compliance with their tax obligations. Do we want to be stopped and asked, “prove that you paid your taxes?” So this is demonizing for the purpose of playing to a base, and it's affecting citizens, permanent residents, asylum applicants, people who've been granted asylum and our undocumented populations. And I just want to give you one statistic there. In New York, the estimate is about, I think it's about 700,000 people are here that have overstayed their visas or entered without inspection. That number, more than half, entered with a visa and overstayed. It may be your British friend who came on a visa waiver and just is hanging out in the East Village. Those people, too, are violating the civil administrative immigration laws. But we don't tend to enforce against them. So what we are also going to see is people of color, people who have accented English, people who live in diverse neighborhoods are going to bear the brunt of this enforcement. And therefore, this is a draconian approach to a very complicated problem.
WEAVER: So is there any way that New York State can fight back against this lawsuit?
BENSON: Of course, they're going to answer it. They'll probably, the first thing they'll do, probably, is make what's called a motion to dismiss. My, my belief is that it will be upheld. We have a Federalist system. We have states that issue our driver's licenses, that design our marriages, that handle our divorces. How aggressive is this administration going to be to create a federal hegemonic power?
WEAVER: Thank you so much, Lenni Benson, for being here with us today.
BENSON: Thank you so much.
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